Techstrong Gang – March 14, 2025

Hey, everyone over at Intel, there's a new boss. Is it the same as the old boss? We're gonna discuss it.

You're watching Textron Gang. Hi everyone. Happy Friday.

Good morning to you. This is Alan Shimmel, and I'm coming to you live, well, semi live. I'm, I'm alive when I did this.

I'm in Orlando. I'm at Ichan. I'm gonna be doing a report on it as one of the segments today.

It's been a great week of cloud native and open and all kinds of great stuff, but we've got a lot more than that to talk about. As usual, it's been another busy week and today's a great news day. Let me introduce you to our gang for today.

It's a lot of the regulars. Number one, I guess, as usual, we'll go to the West Coast where we have our roving marketing pro radio host all around knowledgeable person, the one and only Lisa Martin. Hey Lisa, how are you?

Hey, Alan. Doing great. Good.

It's good to have you on joining Lisa out, out in the Valley or the Bay Area, or whatever you want to call it. I know some, some folks are ashamed to be part of the Silicon Valley community these days. Uh, he is our editor at large there.

John Schwartz. Hey, John. How are you?

I'm good. Uh, won't get fooled again. I like the reference.

Glad to be here. Glad to have you on. And then joining us from, it could be a data center, capital of the East Hudson, Ohio, well, near Columbus.

Anyway, he's the, uh, founder, CEO over at Tech Field Day, our friend Steven Foskett. Good morning, Steven. How are you?

Good morning. It's nice to be here on a day that nothing important happened in the tech industry. Yeah.

Like that ever happens. And then from Ohio will continue east to the wilds of Westchester County, way up in Harrison, upstate New York, our Chief Content Officer, Mike Ard, where The resale value of Yankee tickets are dropping By the minute. Like a rock.

Like a rock. Yep. All right.

Well look, injuries happen. Yeah. Mm-hmm.

You could say you guys got a lump of coal. Um, Oh, no, no. Cole had a lump in his elbow.

That was the problem. Mm-hmm. But anyway, let's, let's talk about the news.

'cause sports between that and the Steelers not having a quarterback, I'm depressed. Um, I, I referenced it in the tease. Intel announced him head honcho, a new head honcho today.

I guess the interim Co CEO model did it wasn't going on forever. Mike, why don't you take us here? Yeah.

People have been waiting for this for a while now. It's kind of been roughly equivalent to waiting for the Vatican to elect the new Pope and some smoke finally came outta the Intel headquarters. But John, you've been following this.

What's going on? Well, um, uh, kudos to you Mike Eagle. I, Mike Ard finds it on the wire immediately as soon as it happens.

So Intel has its fourth CEO in seven years. That doesn't count the co-CEOs, by the way. So Lip Bouton is the new CEO.

He was on the board of a of, of Intel. He quit the board last year. Now he's back on the board.

He is the CEO. He was previously the CEO of Cadence design. And, um, you know, he takes over, essentially this battered, troubled company.

Um, I, you know, I'm writing the story on a deadline. I didn't have enough time to, to mention all the problems they're facing right now, but I'll just recap a few of 'em. Um, they're late and stumbling in the AI market against Nvidia, a MD, Qualcomm, you, you name it.

Sales are declining. The stock is badly bruised. There's threats of killing off the chip acts, chips acts.

There's a delay in a major Ohio plant that they, they showed off last, uh, year, I believe with Gelsinger and Joe Biden. They're in the process of laying off 15,000 people, and they're weighing the idea of either spitting off its Foundry business and or selling its products division, which includes the servers and PC chips. I briefly talked with DA Daniel Newman, and I know Steven talked with them, and Steven Inad even more to, to this.

But Daniel says he expects the move to jumpstart discussion of the, the split of the Foundry business, as well as a focus on reduced spending on resources and projects. He mentioned that BU is known to support a split off of the the Foundry. There's also another interesting thing that Reuters reported late last night, that Intel's Foundry business may be operated by TSMC in a joint venture with Nvidia A MD and Broadcom, whom it is invited to take stakes in the business.

So there's a lot going on. There's lot to process. And, uh, this is a company that's clearly in trouble.

And, um, I I, I don't envy Mr. Tannon the tasky faces. Steven, I know that you had a podcast about the Chips Act, and I know you've been kind of following this whole thing, but what's your take on what's going on here?

Yeah, we've been following the Chips Act really closely on the Gest, uh, the Gestalt I two now, now, now, now called Tech Field Day News Rundown, which is our Wednesday show. Um, and we frankly, uh, the, the, this topic of Yes, of Wednesday, this week's show was what the heck about canceling the Chips act. Uh, then this comes out and, um, and as you, as John mentioned as well, the rumors of a joint venture.

Now, those JV rumors actually hap, uh, came out, um, earlier as well. Dan and, and Pat Morehead were talking about that too. That, that these rumors have been swirling for a while.

But, um, you know, in talking to Dan and, um, you know, kind of catching up on Pat's coverage over overnight of this, there seems to be some, some interesting, um, I dunno, smoke signals here. So, as John mentioned, um, lip Bhutan was, um, on the Intel board. Uh, the rumor is, and this is something that I learned from Pat Morehead, that, um, lip Bu was specifically had a falling out with Gelsinger in August over the idea of splitting the, um, the, the Intel Foundry business in some way.

And, um, lip bu resigned from the board. Um, apparently rumor has it, um, because he, because Pat, uh, stuck in and said, no, we're not spinning it off. And lip boo said, yes we are.

Um, so I think that's a pretty heavy, if that's true, then that's a pretty heavy smoke signal of what's gonna happen next. Uh, the other thing that I learned, um, in talking to Dan Newman is, um, that, uh, lip Bu is absolutely very, very well respected in the, in the, the industry. He's maybe not quite as much of a nerd as Pat was in terms of a, uh, you know, real techies tech.

But this guy's got an engineering degree from MIT. He's, he's the real deal. And having been in charge of Cadence for almost two decades, um, you know, if people aren't aware of Cadence, they're, they're the company that makes the, um, the software that people use to design chips.

The thing that, um, Intel needed to do to make IDF successful was have companies like Cadence support their, uh, manufacturing processes. So, uh, lip Bhutan would be in a really unique position to understand the, the Intel prospective customers for the Foundry business. And I think that that is a really, another really key indicator.

This is somebody who knows Intel, who absolutely knows the business. Um, he understands the perspective of the customers that would be using the Foundry business. He also understands the perspective of the other Intel, which is the one that designs and sells, uh, all sorts of different types of chips.

Uh, all of this bodes well for Intel and the stock market certainly agrees. Uh, but I would say that combine that with the Trump's surprise in his not State of the Union announcing that he wanted to kill the Chips Act, all of this suggests bye-bye Intel as a unified company. They've got to split.

And I think that what's gonna happen is we're gonna have something like the rumored, um, uh, consortium deal where maybe Intel still holds 51% of it, but, uh, companies like TSMC, like, you know, uh, a MD and, and some of the others, uh, invest in it as well. And it becomes really a separate business. Whether Intel even remains a majority shareholder or not, it remains to be seen.

But I, I see no indication, there's no situation where Intel doesn't split the Foundry business, and Columbus isn't the crown jewel in that, in that business. Okay. Lisa, what's the mood in the valley out there?

Because you're out there with John, what are you hearing from folks about, you know, 'cause Intel was always kind of, you know, the Valley, at least the southern part of it for a long time. What's going on? Yeah, you know, we're hearing, um, just kind of surpr shock and awe yesterday at the announcement of Lip Bhutan.

Um, you guys had a great job of recapping what's going on, obviously share falling in process of Shedd 115,000 rather jobs. One of the things that we know about Lib Boutin is that he has a relentless attention to customers. Steven, you mentioned at their huge customer base.

I wanna understand from Intel customers what they're thinking. If Gelsinger was here and Lipan is here from a split perspective, where are the customers? Where are they gonna be supportive?

If, if the new CEO coming in the regime is so supportive of customers, then listen to that feedback and help that drive the next steps? I think that's kind of what we're hearing in the Valley right now. So, so guys, I, I've got some thoughts on this.

First of all, Mike, that's smoke you see coming out of the stove pipe. I don't know if it indicates they've elected a new leader or they're just burning the house down. I, you know, I'm reminded of a, of a cartoon I saw yesterday about, uh, about, uh, homo sapiens, you know, humans having to stop work on the wheel because the Neanderthals are back in power.

We gotta wait until their term is over. And, and clearly, you know, this is a regime change and, and it's an anti Gelsinger kind of move. This seems like Lip Boo was the, the head of the anti Gelsinger, uh, you know, faction on the board that did not, you know, that wanted to break the intel, uh, business into two on the Chips Act.

I, Donald Trump can, can bellow and bluster all he wants. I believe that was an act of Congress that created it and allocated the money. And I believe it's only an act of Congress that'll stop that.

And, and because it is financially involved, I don't know if you'd filibuster senate rules come into play, and I, I'd be very interested to see that new senator from Ohio bet against them or vote against them opening that plant up in, in Columbus with the CHIPS Act map. Two new senators from Ohio, because the other guy got a different job. I'm not sure what he's doing now, but, um, yeah, Okay, so two new senators.

So that, that, that's the second thing. Third thing, I, I, I'm listening to that lineup of JV partners there. What the hell happened to America first?

I don't see an American company. Well, Broadcom is a md, theoretically an American Nvidia company, a md, Nvidia, they're Broadcom, they're all American companies. Yeah.

Hey, You know, wait, didn't you hear that TMSC is an American company now too? 'cause they're moving manufacturing. Oh yeah.

They're moving everything to the United States too As well in Arizona, right? Yeah. Lock, stock and barrel.

You know what, you know, Intel, can I mention something, uh, quickly? So if, if years and years ago, um, one of the questions I always wanted to ask Steve Jobs are, were who are the companies that you really admire in the Valley? Intel was usually in that group.

There were only about three or four Intel at this point. And I just wanna point that they are kind of considered a shadow. They are a shadow of what they used to be that didn't used to be Intel.

And it, I almost kind of wanted to see, but what's happening with them and AI is the same thing. And I know you talked about this earlier in the week, is the same thing that's happening with Apple. These old guard companies that are just not innovative, who can't keep up, who can't pivot.

This is what happens to them. And, and this is gonna be a haul outs. Yeah.

But John, you know, it's the old story of the tortoise and the hare. It's early in the AI game. That's True, that's true At this stage, at this stage of the search engine thing, I was betting on Alta Easter and Excited Home, right?

I never heard of that other crazy company, Stanford. So All I gotta say Is where's Lee ICO when you need him? Because I feel like Uhhuh, this is all gonna be a bell out for the semi.

Here's the thing though. If I'm a businessman and I am a businessman, and I look at the, some of the strategic assets that Intel still retains and some of the market share that they retain, and then I would caution or, or send you all over to the Signal 65 website, a futurum company that does lab testing, and take a look at the recent tests they did on the Intel AI chips and how it stacks up to Nvidia, you know, GPUs and stuff. Don't count Intel out of the AI game.

This is a long, it's a marathon, not a sprint. Great Point. And vitel still has a lot of assets, And you can say the same about Apple.

I know they've been getting a lot of bad press about their, uh, Siri, their smart Siri, but it's the same deal. Intel and Apple are right in there. This is not a, a, a finished space by any means.

And there's still A a lot of, I, I would play their hands any day. I, I'd be happy to have their hands versus some of the others out there. So I, I think that's, that's the, the lesson here.

It's a shame to see an American institution like Intel being chopped up this way. But quite frankly, the foundry, you know, the whole separate foundry from, from, I mean, look, this is a script that Hewlett Packard is played four times, I think, or three times, right? This is right outta Silicon Valley Playbook 1 0 1.

Um, you know, we'll split the company in two or six or seven. Anyway, Hey, we're on a, we're on a short schedule today, so we need to move on. We're gonna take a break here on text on Gang.

We'll be back. I think we're talking nuclear reactors. How exciting.

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Contact us today and tell your story to the world in the most powerful way with Textron Group. Hey folks, we're back in, just as Alan said, we're gonna talk about nuclear energy. A lot of the big tech companies got together and said that by 2050, I think it is, that they hope to be using nuclear energy to drive all kinds of IT services.

Um, seems like a long, long way off to me. But, um, Steven, what's your take on? Is this really gonna happen or is this kind of like, you know, I'm pounding my chest and I'm gonna go kick some ass as soon as I get off this couch.

Did, did you guys invite me on just to be the punching bag? Because I think you might have, okay. No, this is definitely a hundred percent not happening, and it is entirely, every aspect of this story is misguided.

So, so first off, 2050, no, you have no idea what 2050 is gonna be like number one. Okay. Um, let's just put that aside.

Uh, let's say the 2030s, absolutely not, uh, nuclear energy, unfortunately. Now, here's the thing. The, the sad thing is that nuclear fission should be powering all of AI with cleanish energy and, and affordable energy and, and, and, and, and reliable energy today.

But it's not gonna happen because the 1970s happened, and essentially the entire world has turned against nuclear energy to the, to the extent that even in places like China that are actively building nuclear energy, the permitting process, the, uh, requirements around building large nuclear plants make it much, much, much more expensive than it ought to be. Nuclear energy is literally two or three times more expensive than wind or solar. Wind or solar is not all, is not a 24 7 energy source, but nuclear is still much more expensive than burning more coal or burning more, um, natural gas.

That is a problem for businesses. And it's also a problem for anyone who's interested in reducing the reliance on fossil fuels. Now, the next part of this story is this whole small modular reactor thing.

We heard Trump mention that in, uh, his campaign pitch as that, that SMR was somehow going to be a thing. I'm not sure who told him about it, because I doubt that he knows anything about it. But here's the problem with small modular reactors, they don't exist.

You might as well say that flying cars are gonna si solve our, our traffic problem. And you could say, but Steven, there are flying cars. There was one at CES.

Well, we don't know. Small modular reactors exist as much as that CES flying car exist. They exist as much as the aptera, the wonderful cool solar-powered electric mo like cool thing.

It's not flying, but you know, it, these are are theor, uh, almost entirely theoretical. They're still in the lab. There's no such things.

And then this whole idea that there would be micro nuclear reactors that are somehow safe, that is, that is a dream. Yes, the boring company is gonna solve all the traffic in la. If you buy that, then maybe you buy that.

Micro reacts are gonna power these datacenters. The the bottom line is that none of this is real and none of it is gonna happen because nuclear, okay, now pile on. Okay.

No, no, no. I'm gonna just, can I just say one thing really quick? I'll, I'll get outta the way.

Go ahead. 2050 was the tell, tell sign for me. Just like Steven, when I saw that, I thought this is total bs this is a marketing kind of a, a, a, a statements that I read from each of the companies.

Google, Amazon, and I believe it was a third one. Was it Microsoft? Oh my gosh.

Gosh, I hope I'm not dead. Oh, I've meta, excuse me, but I might be. It was meta.

Yeah. So we had Amazon, Google, and Meta with these self-serving comments, we're gonna be providing all this clean energy to suck up all these AI energy demands. And we're gonna do it, we're gonna triple it by 2050 as like triple it from what, um, it, the, the whole thing is, is very kind of fishy.

But you know, I agree with you, Steven. I got your back on this one. So let me, let me jump in here.

Oh, go ahead, Lisa. I was just gonna say, Microsoft wants to restart three Mile Island. That announcement came out with them partnering with Constellation Energy back in, uh, I believe it was August or September.

And the value's going, oh, we covered it. What? Yep.

And, and, and that's at least reasonable and practical and doable, but the cost that Microsoft is paying for that electricity, no kidding. Two x the prevailing cost for electricity. Yes.

All right. So guys, a couple things. I, first of all, I think they picked 2050.

'cause it's gonna take us that long to, to start embracing sustainable energy again after the damage that this administration does to the whole concept of sustainable energy. Well, we, we, hey, we could, we got a guy who can cut down, you know, regulation and stuff like that and make it happen, right? Sell cars on the White House lawn.

But I got one word for you folks. Thorium, thorium China made an announcement yesterday. They fired up their first thorium nuclear reactor.

Now this comes on the heels of China announcing that they found enough thorium salt in inner Mongolia to power their energy needs for the next 60,000 years. You know, who else of the world's leading countries of, of reserves, of thorium deposits the US or Australia, India and Brazil? What's thorium you ask?

Well, thorium is a substitute for uranium, right? It's a salt, it's a molten salt to, to power your nuclear, uh, reaction. You no longer need to cool it with water.

It's meltdown proof. It, it produces a fraction of the radioactive nuclear waste that uranium based, uh, processors do. And you know what?

If China has a, a working model of this, I'm sure we can get together a working model of this. I, I've always look, not that we didn't have problems in nuclear. I, I, I'm a child of three Mile Island and we saw what happened in Chernobyl in Japan, but just because you didn't get it right then doesn't mean we can't get it right going forward.

And thorium could be the answer. And if so, we could probably generate enough energy without fossil fuels here for most of the industrialized world for the next thousands of years, and it could be viable. I'd say that's a worthy goal and a worthy, uh, project for us to do something here in the US about, 'cause China's doing it.

I got 20 bucks that says Elon Musk announce a th powered Tesla in four months. SoftBank's investing in it too, by the way. And, and it goes and it grudges.

4 kilowatts, right? Come on, Dr. Brown.

It Really is worth investigating. And, and again, I'm not, I'm not gonna be a complete Debbie downer on this, because you're right, Alan, theoretically thorium absolutely solves most of the problems that we've had with uranium powered, uh, nuclear reactors. It is absolutely true.

And the other truth is that, you know, unexpected science innovations can happen quickly. You know, look at, um, look at NAND flash. Uh, look at the LED.

These things didn't exist the day I was born. And today they are everywhere and, and we rely on them, you know, quantum, uh, technology, you know, quantum chips haven't worked. But, uh, lemme tell you, quantum photonics is working really, really well.

So it is absolutely possible that in 2050 we could be using small modular thorium reactors that sit on top of our Tesla branded cars. It's also tr uh, likely that Elon Musk could come up with, I don't know, let's call it Nuke X is next to venture and, and making small modular reactors and get a bunch of government funding for that. Um, I just don't see it happening anytime soon, and I don't see it moving the needle.

I think this is a scapegoat from the AI companies to offset the fact that they're using too much energy, it's too fossil fuel powered, and they really don't want to invest to do the hard work to use solar, Right? Steve, Wanna, are they so much billions in like Amazon and Google and Microsoft have invested billions in nuclear energy facilities. So why are they investing that those billions in that if they don't think this is potentially viable?

I think it's a backstop. I think it's a, it's a, it's a, Well, it's, it's good. It's a good story and good gooders.

And just Because I said I'm gonna do something doesn't mean I'm actually gonna, Yeah, yeah. I think we're gonna do traces of all these, uh, manufacturing facilities that are gonna be built over the next four years, like Stargate and et cetera. You know, they just throw these numbers out.

What, but they actually do is another matter. So guys at one of the keynote here on Tuesday, I think it was, uh, they, they had several data center operators who were Sousa partners come up and they talked about what the energy needs of a, a multi gigawatt data center are, right? Because keep in mind, the average house uses, I think two kilowatts, uh, a half a rack of moderate Nvidia, not the, not the new, the newest ones, Brook, well, Brookstone, whatever they are.

Um, but the moderate Nvidia, a half a rack of that, if a house uses two kilowatts, a half a rack uses two megawatts of power and generates enough heat, that air alone won't cool it. You need some sort of liquid cooling, forced air, something. Um, and, and it goes up from there, obviously.

So I'm telling you that if, if we have any hope of supplying these data centers that all these people are talking about, and, and you know, we spoke about the whole data center building, boom, earlier the week, we gotta find something that's gonna do it, right? We, we need some breakthroughs here. We need, you know, the, the, the moon mission resulted in a whole bunch of breakthroughs, the least of which, or maybe not was Tang, uh, but, you know, the instant breakfast strain, but I'm kidding.

But we, we need technology breakthroughs in order to get through that log gen. So where there's a will, there's a way. Necessity is the mother of invention.

And that is what really made America great, because when we have problems like this, we figure out solutions. We don't bluster, we don't nonsense, and all of this other stuff, or try to take over other countries. We innovate, we out-innovate, and we come up with solutions to problems.

And I still think that that's the engine that drives this country. Hey, Steven, before we end this topic, I just wanna see how, how much it hurts me that you think we might invite you up here to be a punching bag, no matter how true that is. Well, uh, I will be your punching bag any day, uh, especially when it Involves Steven.

We, I never think of you as a punching bag, Steven. I, I know I could always count on you to, to toe the line there. Anyway.

Hey, let's take a, a break here on Textron Gang. We're gonna come back with our third, uh, block. And I think I'm gonna talk about Sic Con a little bit.

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Hey folks, we're back. And as Alan alluded to, every now and again, we have somebody who goes to one of these shows and Suse Khan is the latest and they give us a field report of what's going on. Alan, you're the designated attendee at this show for Suse Khan.

So is suse, step it out of the shadow of all these other open source companies? What's going on? So if I'm Des now I know why I haven't been drinking.

I'm the designated attendee. Um, anyway, you know, it, it's a funny thing about Cuse, right? So, you know, they, they are, to me, the the stereotypical European country, right?

Very, you know, they're, they're based in Luxembourg obviously for tax purposes, but they're a German company and they have that very German stoic sort of way. Their marketing is usually understated, very factual, not flashy or fancy. You could see, I don't know how much you could see of my background here, but you know, their, their slogan is, choice Happens.

And, um, and that's what they've been, they've been a, a, an amazing member of the open source community for many years. Their Linux is a respected, everything they do is res, you know, all of their products are respected, if not market leaders. But I gotta tell you guys, I've been here, I've met with most of their leadership.

I've met with a lot of partners, a lot of customers. We have videos that'll be on text, on TV of this. I'm telling you, suse is positioned to be the cloud made of Powerhouse.

If I'm Red Hat, get, get worried. And, and I'll, I'll tell you why. The last couple years they've done a bunch of different acquisitions starting with Rancher, the Rancher os and the Rancher, Kubernetes, uh, distro, uh, new Vector for security stack state for observability.

And I saw something, a demo, not really a demo, but a diagram of, uh, what they're calling their dev Dev X design framework. I think it's framework. I I have an article on Cloud native now that you could read about this.

And I felt like Dave Marsh when he saw Bruce Springsteen in the mid seventies. I've seen the future of Cloud Native and it's suse. They've put together a A to Z soup to nuts package where you've got your underlying Linux, you've got your underlying K eights, your Kubernetes, whether you're running it public cloud, private cloud, V Edge, bare metal.

They, they have the, uh, the other rancher project, not K eights. I think it's K three or K four, whatever, like a, a smaller foot. Yep, a smaller footprint.

They've now married that though, where they're, they've created their own Susa repo or Souse registry. They've taken the most popular open source projects, ified them in that they slimmed down any extra extraneous, unnecessary packages, kept them open. They check 'em for security, they scan them, repackaged them, and make 'em available to the suer customer base.

They're open. Anyone can use me. You don't have to buy 'em.

But now, so now you don't have to worry about the danger of, of downloading apps and components in the wild from a GitHub or whatever. They're, they're securing those really nice thing. Then on top of that, the whole new vector piece keeps your, your cloud native infrastructure compliant and secure, of course, with EU regulations as well as just general good security and the, and the, and then the Stack State piece, which is now Cuse Observability really lets you manage the whole thing.

Pre-deployment, post-deployment, e everything you want from a great observability solution, but it's suse. It's suse still. If any of those parts doesn't tickle your fancy and you wanna replace it with the pure open source or with another solution, you could plug that right in as well.

You could plug it right in as well. Now, I'm telling you, I've been following the cloud native space for many years at Cloud Native Now, before it was called Container Journal. We're doing this, I don't know, 7, 8, 9 years.

I've only seen one other company that has this stack A to B, right? And that's a company that IBM bought, right? And, and since IBM bought them, you know, red Hat is a great tool for the IBM consultants to sell.

But, you know, in terms of innovation, well, they're doing some stuff with ai. I think SUSE is going to give them a run for their money. Um, they know they got the goods too, and I think you're gonna see a very different marketing approach from them going forward.

I'm, I'm really bullish on suse. Let me play devil's advocate here. 'cause one of the criticisms of suse watch this and all those cloud Companies watch, he wants to make me the punching bag.

Go ahead, I'll hold you down. There you Go. But, but the issue is like it's, and it's the CNCF landscape is the physical representation of this issue, right?

There's so many pieces and components that you're supposed to stitch together that people get overwhelmed. And, um, nothing is quite integrated as, as well as it should be. And over time, I wind up, you know, hiring a small army of people to maintain this snowflake of a platform I've created.

And then I'm either locked into various components or I'm terrified to replace anything or add anything. 'cause it's gonna break. And, and, but that's the beauty of this DevX platform.

You, it, it takes the hard work of going through the 200 CNCF projects. It works with helm charts, it works, it works with all the usual suspects, but that's all behind the little Green chameleon that is Susa. And you know, I, I think it really does.

It, it takes exactly what you're talking about, Mike. This is the solution for it. But if you still wanna go play in that open source Wonderland, have at it, but you don't have to.

Seus has brought it all together for you in a secure, manageable, commercially scalable way. And I think that's what this market needs. Did you hear anybody talking about platform engineering while you were there?

Yes. Because who is this DevX platform aimed at DevOps team, platform engineers, security people, and of course developers and, and this, the platform engineers are gonna love what SUSE has in terms of setting up your platform to go fast and secure. And, and by the way, I, while here, I spoke to HPE and Dell and AWS and, uh, uh, court works and, and a bunch of your other strategic partners, and they, they are also all in on this.

They think, you know, this really is going to be a big deal for, for cloud native. All right? My money says that other people will go build platforms that we're gonna see a rollup of all these companies that are providing these little widgets are on the side of these things and, and will be platform versus platforms, but there'll be more than two.

So I, I don't, you know, there were a few companies that have the breadth to do this at scale. Red Hat, certainly one of them. I think SUSE is, and also remember Suso was a public company that a PE took private, but it wasn't the usual pe Let's take it and sell the parts like Gordon Gecko, right?

It it, they've actually invested a lot into suse and they're doing things that aren't necessarily quarter to quarter that a public company has to live with. And, um, it, look, I I, I'll stand by my words. I'm bullish.

All right? Fair. All right, guys.

If that's, If, if, If, I'm sorry, Mike, If you could go to Las Vegas and bet on suse. I think, you know, your chips are all in, right? I never go all in on anything.

All right. Uh, if anyone, if no one has anything else, I'm gonna lock this up because I've got people waiting in my green room here to do more videos. I'm, I'll be here through the end of the day doing videos.

I'll be, I will be back on the gang on Monday. I won't be on Friday. Mike, if I don't speak to you before then, have a great St.

Patrick's Day. Will do, man. It's Gonna know it's the highlight of the year for you.

It's, it's a, it's on a Monday, which is, means it's a three day weekend. So there you go. Abso you know what, I, I actually, I met the Dell CTO for ea I interviewed, I didn't, I have to introduce to him, really nice fella named, um, uh, I think it's Brian Orion or, or, or Reagan.

Brian O. Reagan. He, he's invited us to Ireland to come see what Dell's doing out there.

I said I just, I got just the guy to do it. I think. I think we're gonna have to open up the worldwide Irish DevOps chapter And you're the president.

Alright. It's the bureau of your bureau. Yeah.

Alright. Thank you Steve, John, Lisa, Mike for joining us on a somewhat shortened version of the Gang today. As usual, we have a full text on TV lineup following this, so stay tuned for that.

We will be back Monday with some really great fresh content. Um, until then, I'm Alan Shimmel. Everyone have a great weekend.

We're out.